Why isn’t this ‘terrorism’, but just ‘communal-issues’?

 

Let us take a short trip through the recent happenings..

 

 

On 24 December 2007, while the Christians were getting ready to celebrate the birth of Lord Jesus Christ, Swami Laxmananda Saraswati, a member of a Hindu fundamentalist organization (Vishwa Hindu Parishad) and his supporters attacked and destroyed many churches and prayer centres. A large number of Christians were injured and made homeless in the communally sensitive district of Kandhmal, in Orissa state, eastern India.

Exactly eight months later, on 23 August 2008 when the same seer and the Hindu community were preparing to celebrate the birthday of Lord Krishna (Janmashtami) in Jalespata ashram (monastery), he and four of his disciples were gunned down by tribal revolutionary Maoists.(Read more)

 

Claiming responsibility for the killing of VHP leader Swami Lakshmananda Saraswati in Orissa, that sparked off violent protests, the Communist Party of India (Maoist) on Sunday warned the saffron outfit of “more such punishments if it continued violence against religious minorities in the country”. CPI (Maoist) has decided to punish “anti-people, fanatical leaders”, a party release said.(Read more)

 

VHP does not believe Maoists killed its functionary in Orissa

 Expressing doubts over the Maoists’ claim of having killed Lakshmananda Saraswati, VHP on Monday insisted that “a sect of Christians” was behind the murder that has sparked widespread rioting in Orissa. VHP General Secretary Pravin Togadia said his organisation and the Maoists have no reasons for confrontation and the Maoists could have made the claims under “Communist influence” to divert attention.(Read more)

 

Very funny..I wonder if  they would have said so,if the same claim came from some jihadists.Things would have taken a different turn then and even Mr Bush would have come down to make comments “Islam is terror”.. 🙄

 

A Catholic nun was burnt alive by a group of Hindu fundamentalists who stormed the orphanage she ran in the district of Bargarh (Orissa), this according to Police Superintendent Ashok Biswall. A priest who was at the orphanage was also badly hurt and is now being treated in hospital for multiple burns. Another nun from Bubaneshwar’s Social Centre was gang raped by groups of Hindu extremists before the building housing the facility was set on fire..(Read more)

 

Gayadhar Digal paid the price for taking matters of religion

in a communally troubled part of the state too lightly. He was born a Hindu and died a Hindu, but in between he proclaimed his liking for Christianity. This cost him his life at his native Kasinipadar village in Phiringia block of Kandhmal district.On Tuesday afternoon, Sangh Parivar men, enraged over the killings of senior VHP leader Swami Laxmananda Saraswati and his disciples, attacked his house. Gayadhar, with his wife and son, ran for safety only to be hacked one km away in the field. Gayadhar succumbed. Raimati and Baisnab, a school student, are battling for lives in hospital. Attackers set ablaze many of the 350 houses in the village, with the Digals suffering the most: losing their breadwinner.(Read more)
 

 

 

With 40 per cent of the population made up of Tribals and Dalits (outcasts) , Orissa is one of the most underdeveloped states in the country,where caste systems are deep rooted. All their leaders keep them away from getting educated and civilized. Because once they are educated and civilized they will never be able to exploit them for their own selfish motives.

 

Many Christian institutions in India have been existing for more than 100 years and the most recent population census shows that 2.3% Indians are Christian.If they were solely out to propogate christianity,most of us would have been Christians by now.

The total number of Christians in India as per Census in 2001 are 24,080,016 or 2.34% of the population” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_in_India

 

The best education is provided by the schools run by the Christian organizations. If Christian missionaries are so dangerous,why don’t people stop sending their kids to convent-schools,instead of government ones..Why don’t you go to government hospitals instead of Christian specialities? If all these institutions closed down,we’ld have to regret about it.

  

I wonder why the conversion-issue is too sentimental.Is ‘culture’ more important than a person’s meal, his clothes and shelter? Should I die hungry in the name of religion or culture, or should I move forward by grabbing opportunities in front on me?I don’t mind who is it that provided facilities..I am a muslim,and my parents enrolled me in a Christian missionary school and being an adult,I realize that it was the best thing that happened to me, rather than having spent my life in some crappy muslim or hindu school.. There are exceptions of both hindus and muslims running institutions in a very good manner.. But usually ,due to inner fight,its all messed up.And as a mother,I wish to sent my kid to such a school as the one I studied.

  

If non-christians are so worried about their culture and religion being corrupted, why don’t they use the same energy to provide infrastructure to those ‘converts’ so that nobody can fool them.. Missionaries maybe exploiting people’s helplessness.. But rather than burning nuns,why don’t these cultural people spent their time ,effort and money to provide education and other services to those poor people so that even Christians and Muslims will convert to Hinduism..That requires some effort uh?

 

 Above all,I find it strange where the moderate hindus have vanished ,that I don’t see any reports of them condemning the fundamentalists and extremists.. Well,are muslims alone expected to do such a thing,when some holy-war guy blasts up?

 

 I feel sad and I am afraid seeing the polarization of people in the name of religion..No religion preaches hatred.Even I myself had never such thoughts all my life,but at this point of time,I am afraid I am also becoming ‘communal’ by speaking for people around me..Even many near and dear ones are talking very strange..I am surprised as to see how the scenario has changed in a matter of few years…God bless all and may all of us be able to live in peace and harmony..

 

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    • Subhas Chandra
    • September 3rd, 2008

    hey r u trying to get more hits through these spiritual blogs ??

  1. It’s sad that tags like caste, religion, language are holding the immediate need for development hostage. I feel bad for the people who are mere pawns in the game of different parties who fish in troubled waters.

    • Nimmy
    • September 3rd, 2008

    @Subhas,lol…do you have any cash prize for blog with more hits..lol…I never knew:)

    @Pradeep,very true..We are just being made fools…

    • Arjun
    • September 4th, 2008

    I think its time to retort in the same langauge you were using in your blogs….I dont think it is right to write a blog to take your personnel vengence against one person and his ideologies…

    I would reframe some of your sentences to answer your questions,

    1. I find it strange where the moderate hindus have vanished ?
    “If atleast 5% of Hindus were extremists,most of u would have been Hindus bynow.
    ” The total % of Hindus in India as per Census in 2001 have reduced”

    2. 99 % of the hindus are against the killing of nuns or other forms of extremism…

    When a comic cartoon of Muhammed was published I could see a huge outcry by the so-called secularists(congress CPM DMK SP and others) holding potest rallies in all parts of the country.

    But when Congress plrclaimed in the highest court of India that Ram didnt exist I didnt see any outcry by these secularists.Infact they went on to support their claim.

    3. We could see a huge subsidy given to the Haj pilgrimage.Why is it for ?

    At the same time, I could see KSRTC charging double than normal charges for buses to Sabarimala.

    4.When people quote from authentic sources you are saying you wont believe as they are not correct…Then y the hell do you think we should believe you…

    Going though blog serious I dont think you are a secularist person to talk abt secularism

    *I heavily condemn the killing of nuns and common ppl.But its a 2 sided story where both the religious groups are culprits

  2. Nimmy, the silent reader speaks.

    Jokes apart, I cant have written this better. Its absolutely unbiased – something I claim myself to be, being an agnostic. And with facts, your words and cries carry a lot more.

    Let me say this, we are all, at least the very few of us who are concerned about human loss, worried about these sad state of affairs. And in writing about them, we put ourselves in a difficult position. And I was wondering was there any point.. but now I feel there is. This is the little something we could do. Not that your post or mine could convert anyone’s prejudism or deep rooted beliefs and ideas, but your post does spread awareness, and if at least one person feels there is something in all this we write, thats a lot.

    Like you know, I have been questioned what good was angry frustrated blogging going to do and suggest practical measures. But writing was expressing and talking to the world. Going out to the street, grabbing a mike and talking to the masses is not a possible scenario. But this is the next closest thing as far as I am concerned. I can speak better through what I write and I am glad we could do something that way. Cause it reaches readers…

    I am really happy to see this post Nimmi. I wish more people would join the quest for a just and fair and equal world we all hope to have one day. What the people who laugh at these “dreaming idiots” dont realize is if they, instead of laughing, joined the small minority of us who stood apart from the killing and unjust world, it makes a huge difference. Because each person is important. As is their life.

    • Nimmy
    • September 4th, 2008

    @Arjun,I understand your anger and frustration,bcoz I always feel the same way whenever people,including secular people (my friends included) point fingers at the the muslim commuinity as a whole whenever a jidadist blasts up? Why don’t you remember that we are hurt the same way as you are now?

    “I dont think it is right to write a blog to take your personnel vengence against one person and his ideologies…”

    lol..Im not taking revenge.Am I a saddist to laugh at people’s death..Hindu,Christian or Muslim,people are just human beings,with the same colour of blood,as it runs through mine..so,this is not something the way you out it..Instead,Im trying to see the other side of world around us.

    “If atleast 5% of Hindus were extremists,most of u would have been Hindus by now.”

    Maybe or may not be..As told,since christians have been here for centuries,still you and me are hindu and muslim,but many around us have converted,it may or may not happen..Well,did I ever say that most hindus are extremists?No,I didn’t…

    “The total % of Hindus in India as per Census in 2001 have reduced”

    I agree..Then again,the total% of christains have gone done,to a slight extent,and % of muslims have gone up..LOL,I have heard people saying that its bcoz muslims breed like rats:)..Unfortunately,they are not bothered to look into the fact that Kashmir,a muslim majority state, was included in 2001 census,whereas it was not included in 1991,and thus account for higher % of total indian muslims..If one excludes the Muslims of Kashmir from the 2001 figures, the growth rate of the Muslim population is 29.3%, which is much lower than the growth figure of the earlier decade..Arjun,alteast people like you and me should look into the facts,unlike fat, crappy politicians who are trying to make us donkeys…

    ” 99 % of the hindus are against the killing of nuns or other forms of extremism…”..

    I have no doubt about it..In my whole lifetime,living in hindu majority society,i have never seen an extremist..so I can understand the ratio of extremists to peaceful people..But I am sad that many people don’t apply the same logic when it comes to extremists-peaceful muslims..

    “When a comic cartoon of Muhammed was published I could see a huge outcry by the so-called secularists(congress CPM DMK SP and others) holding potest rallies in all parts of the country.”..

    If you think that they did it our of passion and love for muslims,I think you are mistaken.Personally,I believe that there wasn’t a need for such a big outcry by muslims regarding the cartoon.This is a free world and people are free to write and read what they like.If muslims love Prophet(pbuh) so dearly,protest in the Islamic way..grab such opportunity to let people know what real Prophet was,what his peaceful teachings was and like,instead of going around and burning shops,which in turn,helps the real intentions of those cartoonists-portray muslims as devils..Sadly,most people fall prey to it..

    About political parties ‘protesting’,I don’t think it’s a sincere one..Basically,Muhammed and Ram means nothing to them,except source of votes.(im not good in politics,so my comment may be wrong)

    “We could see a huge subsidy given to the Haj pilgrimage.Why is it for ?
    At the same time, I could see KSRTC charging double than normal charges for buses to Sabarimala.”

    Thank you for raising this point..I have always heard that ‘muslims are leechers and beggers when it comes to hajj subsidy’..Ever bothered to look beyond?Hajj subsidy is nothing but governments means to run Air-India in profit..over 1,00,000 passengers in a short span,that too flying them on incresed rates,which are then subsidized ..lol..In simple words,if government removes the monopoly of Ari india over hajj sector,pilgrims can travel at a much lesser cost that the ‘subsidy’ ..Now you tell me why government is not doing that?Tell me who is benefitted here,Air-India or Muslims?

    Moroever, muslims have been asking to scrap down the hajj subsidy.Then have realized that it is only a means for vote-bank,and moreover,it is not islamic to travel to Mecca, on somebody else’s money..

    http://www.hindustantimes.com/storypage/storypage.aspx?id=15cf0780-6680-4d51-a478-da61c226adb2&&Headline=Muslims+want+Haj+subsidies+scrapped

    “An Indian Muslim, who chooses to go to Haj through government run Haj committees, gets a subsidy of around Rs. 20,000 on their Air India ticket of Rs. 32,000. That is it ! The minimum cost of a Haj package through the Haj committees is around Rs. 92,000, of which Rs. 20,000 is paid by the Indian government to Air India as a subsidy on the Hajis ticket. The total Haj airline ticket subsidy was around Rs. 150 crore for the year 2001 and has been enmarked to Rs. 225 crores for the year 2005. It is interesting to note that the normal ticket to Saudi Arabia costs around Rs. 25,000 but Air India charges Rs. 34,000 from the Hajis. So, effectively the government is giving a subsidy of Rs. 12,000 only !

    The Sangh Parivar zealots make is sound like that the Indian government sponspors an Annual-Go-To-Haj trip for anyone who is interested. Why this is such a big issue for them? I don’t think the amount involved (Rs. 225 crores) is the itching factor. They are more piqued at the fact that it allows Muslims to go to Mecca and Medina, their holy cities which are outside India, out there is some land called Arabia. The usual argument of these fanatics is that India and India alone should be the pitrabhuumi (fatherland) and punyabhuumi (holyland) of all Indians and since the holy places of Muslims and Christians are elsewhere, they can never be patriotic enough. This argument would have been plain ridiculous had it not been so malevolent. So, what they are trying to say is that a Hindu born and brought up in USA can not be patriotic enough to USA, if he chooses to visit the Somnath mandir in India as a pilgrim. A Swede, who converts to Hinduism, can not be loyal to Sweden if he scouts Mathura and Varanasi in search of spiritual salvation. The patriotism of all Sikhs who visit Nankana sahab in Pakistan is somehow suspect and all Hindus who undergo the arduous Kailash Mansarovar pilgrimage can not be termed Indians anymore because that site is under Chinese dominion. Welcome to Ram Rajya 2.0, as espoused by a few hate mongers. But then, these gentlemen hardly talk or understand a five lettered word, ’sense’. We would let them go for the time being.”

    http://indianmuslims.in/haj-subsidy-anyone/

    Finally,

    When people quote from authentic sources you are saying you wont believe as they are not correct…Then y the hell do you think we should believe you…”..

    Tell me Arjun,what was the biased source I quoted throughout the blog? If you find zeenews,ndtvnews,mumbaimirror,human rights watch reports,doctors beyond borders report and like unauthentic and biased,I don’t know where do you get your news from?Afterall,can you pls tell me source of unbiased news?I’ll be obliged..Pls dn’t state otherwise,bcoz I have taken much care not to quote from random websites,as not to provide any biased data.If I were to do that,I’ld have quoted a website on statistics in kashmir violence,but I didn’t as through look tells me that its just Islamic propaganda..

    “Then y the hell do you think we should believe you”..

    You are free to believe me or not..This is a free world..I respect your choice of opinion..But I request you to provide your source of authentic information..Pls do..

    “Going though blog serious I dont think you are a secularist person to talk abt secularism”

    Secularism have become a subjective term there days,so I again won’t object..

    “heavily condemn the killing of nuns and common ppl.But its a 2 sided story where both the religious groups are culprits”..

    Good,But did I say otherwise?I emphasized that Missionaries may be exploiting their helplessness..But then again,my small brain tells me that there are much better ways to deal with it..But if you find no issues with it,then I wonder why you have issues woth jihadists as they also claim to do so for a ‘holy cause’..

    Again,this post is not to bash hindus ‘on the same coin’,but just putting forward the other side of what we call it terrorism..If blasting up is terrorrism, this is also plain terrorism..

    Sorry for the long rant and sorry for all grammar and splelling mistakes..Im little busy..Good day..

    • Nimmy
    • September 4th, 2008

    Hey Cris…………….Thank you so much for your opinion:)

    Glad to see you here dear..lol..im so happy today …

    Because each person is important. As is their life.”..

    Excatly right..In fact I always try to advocate the fact that this can happen to you and me tomorrow..We sit on counches,and hear news of blasts and rapes,while eating popcorn.I am angry and worried over the delusion of people that this is not going to happen to them..My idea is simple,”If you don’t speak for those unfortunate people today ,when it happens to you tomorrow,don’t expect anybody to speak for you”..Give and Take..Live and let live..As simple as that..

    Again,thank you Cris:-)

    • Vineeth
    • September 4th, 2008

    Hi,
    Whatever happened in Orissa is wrong.
    Nobody disagrees on that.

    At the same time, i want to clarify some points –
    (1)
    There is a difference in how as a religion Hindusim functions and how christianity or islam functions.
    First of all there was/is as such no relgion called Hindu religion, it is/was a way of living/lifestyle for people called “Sanatana Dharma” .The term “Sanatana Dharma” can be roughly translated to mean “Eternal Natural Law.
    If anybody claims optherwise he is blatantly worng.
    Hinduism has no central doctrinal authority and many practising Hindus do not claim to belong to any particular denomination. However, we can categorize contemporary Hinduism into four major denominations on a grosser level : Vaishnavism, Shaivism, Shaktism and Smartism

    And on a subtler or spiritual level there are 6 different schools of philosophies under it like –
    Advaita
    Vishishtadvaita
    Dvaita
    Dvaitādvaita
    Shuddhadvaita
    Achintya Bhedābheda

    So to answer your question “If non-christians are so worried about their culture and religion being corrupted, why don’t they use the same energy to provide infrastructure to those ‘converts’ so that nobody can fool them.. Missionaries maybe exploiting people’s helplessness.. But rather than burning nuns,why don’t these cultural people spent their time ,effort and money to provide education and other services to those poor people so that even Christians and Muslims will convert to Hinduism..That requires some effort uh?”

    Technically there is no hard and fast rule which defines anybody as “Hindu”. There are even atheistic people who are hindus.
    Hence you see in the history nowhere was conversion done by hindus.
    (2)
    I agree that a lot of good activities are done by missionaries esp in education and health care, giving good credit to them for that, at the same time they indulge in forceful religious conversion which is a serious issue because that is the root cause of the problem.

    Even though the method used by the fundamentalists in Orissa is blatently wrong, that was triggered by two things –
    1. Forceful conversions done.
    2. A vast majority of hindus feel, anybody can take hindus for a ride in a country where they are the majority.

    I dont see any other country in the world where nobody voices for majority (for eg,In Saudi Arabia during Ramadan even non muslims arent allowed to eat outside. I am not against it just saying there are no such restrictions in India).

    I am not against any measures done for other communities, at the same time I feel not enough is done by anybody for the people belonging to the hindu community, who are the majority.(Pl note, i dont like to differentiate people in any basis esp religion, but what i am writing is the natural feeling a secular hindu currently has in India).

    To be outright hence forth to stop such outrageous and merciless killings if the above two issues are resolved you would not see any such killings
    1. by the missionaries and 2. by the politicians.

    Finally please dont judge Hinduism or concepts like RamaRajya on the basis of what VHP or BJP or such people proclaim.
    Please understand the concepts of these from authentic sources or learned people and form your opinion on this.
    I am nobody to advice you, but this is just my suggetion.

    Vineeth

    • Nimmy
    • September 4th, 2008

    @Vineeth,you said it exactly right..

    “Finally please dont judge Hinduism or concepts like RamaRajya on the basis of what VHP or BJP or such people proclaim.
    Please understand the concepts of these from authentic sources or learned people and form your opinion on this.
    I am nobody to advice you, but this is just my suggetion.”

    Same goes for Islam and muslims too dear Vineeth..don’t judge a car by its driver..

    Again,I never said Hinduism is violent or crap as some people stereotype Islam and Muslims..

    Remember,my best friends are hindus:-)

    And I beg you,PLS DON’T COMPARE CRAPPY SAUDI WITH iSLAMIC VALUES..THEY ARE WAHABBIS,WHO HAVE THEIR OWN CRAZY LAWS,LIKE BEATING WOMEN WHO DON’T WEAR PARDHA,CLOSING DOWN SHOPS,not letting women drive..they have their own culture,and it is not to be mistaken with the wrong equation “Saudi Arabia is what islam is”

    The Qur’an says:

    [“Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects Taghut (evil) and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trust worthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things. ” (Qur’an 2:256)]

    • Arjun
    • September 4th, 2008

    @Nimmy,
    First of all, I am very happy that you agree to most parts of my comment.
    Regarding the authenticity of of articles, I was not bashing you.But infact taking you on with your own weapon.Whatever I had wriiten about authenticity is what you wrote when another person took you on with statistics(in one of the previous blogs)..

    As a reply you agreed that the so-called secularist are in most cases play minority appeasement politics…I think more than terrorism,this is what is hurting the actual secular people like me..

    @Cris

    I appreciate you blogs for the frankness and its human values…

    • Vineeth
    • September 4th, 2008

    @Nimmy….
    i dont judge Islam on the basis of what many are doing in today’s world, also i understand that you are pained by the common judgement which people are coming too on islam as a religion on the basis that many terrorists are born in islamic families.

    Trust me when i say i know the real essence of islam aka its spiritual aspects… i just felt that i needed to add those perspectives which i mentioned to the story to make it complete.

    • Nimmy
    • September 4th, 2008

    @Arjun,I agre..In most cases,so called privileges are only way for them to make minorities vote for them.

    Again,I’ld say that hindus should not be discriminated in any way,just bcoz they happened to majority..All people,should be taken care of..I am aware of very poor brahmins,but they ahve no reservation,while some rich muslims can claim reservation..This unfair way of dealing things are making things worse..In my opinion,people should be able to amke reservation on indiviudal or family basis..Nothing more nothing les..I meant,give reservation according to social and financial status of family,may it be hindu,muslim ,christian or dalit..Wish it happens soon,so that all of us can live in peace and harmony..

    I understand that Hindus maybe feeling insecure bcoz all so called secular parties are doing ‘extra stuff’ to minorities..But joining with the extremists,for the sake of insecurity is not the right way..Bcoz that is the same way it happens with jihadists.They are desperate and have no hope for justice and facilities,so they join the extremists who have thier own version of Quran ,and set out to ruin others life..We need to remove the underlying cause,not the outward protrusion..

    • Nimmy
    • September 4th, 2008

    @Vineeth,I very much value your input as I learned lot,and it is great to hear from level headed people who understands it by brain rather than by heart..At times we need to be less sentimental ,and thing and act wise..Sadly,when it comes to religion,alomst ll of us thing with heart and not with brain,and I guess that is the root cause of all these issues..No religion preaches hatred or violence..

    • Arjun
    • September 4th, 2008

    @Nimmy,

    I agree with you completely….I am not against any community or person….

    I empathise with secular Muslims,as I feel there is unnecessary tag of ‘terrorists’ attached with them…. and all the people around should fight together to identify the minority terrorists that exist in every religion and fight together to eradicate terrorism and other social evils….

    • Vineeth
    • September 4th, 2008

    @Nimmy, i can understand your sentiments.
    Please be assured that people atleast those like me, don’t judge islam or for that matter any religion, on the basis of what some people born in that religion prepetuate in the wrong way….
    You may feel that lot of such judgement is happening, but the vast majority in this country don’t speak their actual opinion about it openly… the few who make outrageous opinion, do not speak about the opinion of the majority… you can be assured abt that.

    • Nimmy
    • September 4th, 2008

    @Arjun & Vineeth,thanks for that:-) In fact people like you make people lke me assured that its not late and life in india is still the best than in any other place..Good day to all

    • Milind Kher
    • September 4th, 2008

    I am truly happy to see that many people are coming out with very level headed comments here. This is good because blogs like this create a platform where harmony can grow.

    Nimmy, I am glad you have created a blog like this. Keep up the good work.

    • Ramesh
    • September 4th, 2008

    U talk of secularism with a bias towards Muslims.Is all over your blog.Sad.

    • Nimmy
    • September 4th, 2008

    @Milind,thank you…I am just trying to see the other side..
    @Ramesh,I agree..Maybe bcoz I see lot of hate against muslims around me..Am I wrong?

  3. Hey,

    Found this blog via my sister’s blog 🙂

    My comment is in response to your subtle suggestion that people always make more of a fuss about Islamic terrorism.

    In general, terrorism and terrorists exist in all religious groups (Hinduism, Islam, Christianity, and even Communism).

    But statistically (and unfortunately) it’s Islamic terrorism that is the most widespread and the most media-covered and thus that’s what’s on everyone’s mind.

    If you look at terrorist groups and terrorism incidents you’ll find that the number of Islamic terrorism related incidents far outweigh those of the other groups put together.

    This makes it difficult for moderate Islamists because they are wrongly classified as supporters of terrorism. People are not automatically logical – so they just got with their gut feeling. Which is a pity.

    Not being religious, for me, a terrorist is a terrorist, whatever be his religious or cultural origin. But it may not be the same for religious non-Muslims.

    • Nimmy
    • September 4th, 2008

    Thanks for visiting Nish..Know you through Cris,and mostly through codepreoject,which helped me lot during hard times of project..:-)

    Terrorism is a religion in itself ..Also it is plain fact that there are lot of muslim blasters here..But then again,stereotyping will only do more harm..

    • Vineeth
    • September 5th, 2008

    @Nimmy

    “VHP does not believe Maoists killed its functionary in Orissa”

    I can quote a famous statement by Dhuryodhana in Mahabharat ” Chattathu keechakanengil konnathu Bheeman thanne “.

    Secondly..

    ” The total number of Christians in India as per Census in 2001 are 24,080,016 or 2.34% of the population” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_in_India

    I know few ppl from Orissa where even if u reach its capital Bhubaneshwar , u vll take atleast 1 1/2 days to reach ur village in some of the districts where nobody knows how many ppl leave there .Khandamal is one among that and in those areas ppl wont go to any village office and enroll their children name as Hindu or Christian.Same case applied to North East as well.
    And i know in Muslim populated areas they wont admit any govt officials.This is vat i hed abt Secunderabad ,one of the Metropolitan city. You can imagine vat wud be the case with other parts of India.
    So dont pull some stats from wiki n portray these r the real stats.its estimated Christians r around 7-8% and Muslims are around 21% and in most of the North East states Christians are the Majority pouplation now.

    For every action there will be an equal and opp reaction , recently Karan Thappar asked a Christian Head of Orissa “For the larger interest of the nation can you hold ur convertion activites for sometime ” His reply was irresponsible “No”.

    There is fashion is this country to be called “Secular” when he talk antiHindu..Even i agree killing human beings in the name of religion is condemnable.But somebody coming with a hidden agenda from outside to change the demographic of our country is an another mode of terrorism, its “SoftTerrorism” that should be treated with iron hands. u r welcome to disagree here..
    I would like to quote a statement of one of the greatest human being lived on this planet about Christian Missionaries proselytization , Gandhiji said ” I should certainly stop all proselytizing. It is the cause of much avoidable conflict between classes and unnecessary heart-burning among missionaries. But I should welcome people of any nationality if they came to serve here for the sake of service. In Hindu households the advent of a missionary has meant the disruption of the family coming in the wake of change of dress, manners, language, food and drink.”

    JaiHind

    • Nimmy
    • September 6th, 2008

    @Vineeth,sorry for late reply..Friday is a holiday here:)

    you make a very very very dangerous statement..

    ” Chattathu keechakanengil konnathu Bheeman thanne “.

    You are generalizing here that if VHP leader is killed,its obviously Christians..Right?This is what happens whenever a bomb blasts in our nation..When a blast occures,automatically muslims are burdened with the blame..first they blame Pakistan and then they blame some ‘muslim’ organization..Can you tell me,was any of such blames proved?Police arrest hundreds of youth,roll them,beat them and make a squash of them and finally come out successfully claiming that ‘they have confessed”..As far as I know,the law doesn’t recognize ‘confession’ as an evidence bcoz it is given under presure..But in almost all blast cases,confession is the only outcome..

    Moreover,we laymen are not interested in having a follow up..Police comes with ‘confession’ and we are happy reading it in newspapers..

    Christians r around 7-8% and Muslims are around 21% and in most of the North East states Christians are the Majority pouplation now.

    Can you please quote your source..I don’t trust wiki too much as anybody can edit it..But at times,when the data given correlate with that in other sites,I tend to quote them..

    You say,

    “that should be treated with iron hands.”..

    I think you should apply the same logic and should not be worried bcoz so-called muslim ones too have a cause / reason behind the violence they are doing..They say they are protesting against discrimination and torture against them..So are you telling me that you are fine with them blasting up and killing people..err..I guess you went wrong..sorry,I can’t agree with you..May it be people of my faith,or yours or something else..

    And finally,

    Jai Hind… 🙂

    • Raj
    • September 6th, 2008

    US will clear all the Muslim scum from middle east very soon.One after the other.So i don’t have no long term worry.

    • Nimmy
    • September 6th, 2008

    @Raj,lol…that was worth a good laugh..The oil present these makes its inhabitants ‘scums”..Wait for tomorrow when Rajs and Rams in Idia will be their next target..

    Duh,people like you,and not muslims,are terrorists..I am afraid im living alive,with people like you around me..You find nothing wrong in blasting women .kids and innocent people…Human lives in Iraq and Lebanon,are worth the same as dark Indians.Sit back and enjoy all what is happeneing to those people,until your mother and daughter gets raped and you get blasted into pieces,by some ‘rescuers’..Then,don’t expect anybody to speak for you..

    • Arjun P
    • September 6th, 2008

    @Nimmy,

    Some of your comments are provoking me write replies 🙂
    I dont fully agree with Vineeth’s comments.But your reply is equally provocative if not more…

    You said the Islamic groups were blamed unnecessarily for the blasts and is there any evidence against it.

    How come government of India get the evidence.If some Muslims are arrest so-called secular for start complaining about minority rights.You want me to prove my statement…?

    When some of the hard-core terrorist were arrested in Gujarat, the MPs of biggest secular party in the country went to their houses to extend their full support.U can check the authenticity as this is published in all reliable newspapers(but with minimum importance…again appeasement)

    When some of the SIMI leaders were arrested from your hometown the so called human right activists and minority leaders were up in arms to release, which they succeeded..

  4. Well, well.

    First of all, lovely blog Nimmy! I had to stop reading halfway and applaud you!

    Well, Arjun, Vineeth, Ram and Ramesh:

    Some of you have tried to ‘appear’ considerate about other religions and some of you have not.

    But in all of your comments I find a bit of frustration at the events happening in the country. And the urgent need to blame it on someone. The Muslims are conveniently targeted – they already have a bad image since 9/11.. and the Indian Muslims fall among the least educated, worst represented communities in India.

    Let me straighten out some basic facts. Esp. to Nish who sees Muslims at every trouble spot in the world.

    Is Islam to blame?

    Let’s see some of these places.. and see if the problem is religious or political in nature.

    1) Palestine – Political. Palestinians are trying to get a homeland that’s – as per International law – under illegal occupation by a different country. What does the palestinian want? Her country.

    2) Afghanistan – Political. Invasion by a foreign power chasing one man. What does the afghani want? Peace, infrastructure and her country back.

    3) Iraq – Political. Once, perhaps the most secular among the middle east nations, now torn apart by communal strife among Shias, Sunnis and Kurds. Reason? Invasion by a superpower chasing oil. Now lies in ruins and threat of civil war. What does the Iraqi want? Peace and a livelihood.

    4) Kashmir – Political. Extremely political. What does a Kashmiri want? Azadi!

    It’s easy to label everyone a Muslim. What about the LTTE.. are they Hindu terrorists? Surely, they’re the ones who popularized suicide bombing! If theirs can be considered a purely political problem.. why not the above?

    This is not to deny the existence of terrorists and fundamentalists.. but aren’t they there in EVERY major religion?!
    There’s NO difference – ZILCH – between a VHP or a Bajrang Dal and a Lashkar.. the latter is just technologically more superior.
    The Lashkar has access to sophisticated bombs that kill and maim civilians.. the Bajrang Dal, still in its terrorist infancy, just end up blowing themselves in their bomb factories.
    It won’t be long now.

    I too used to think that ‘Secular Muslims’ need to speak up. But today I realize that they have been speaking all along… just that nobody wants to listen to them. The jehadis provide more soundbytes and headline worthy material.

    Nimmy here is doing a good job, and I hope she continues in the same vein!

    I wonder why they still talk about SIMI. They did anti national activities and got banned for it. But what about Bajrang Dal?

    They’ve been caught making bombs for god’s sakes!! What about Shiv Sena? Their supremo Bal-T has openly called for Hindu suicide squads (sounds familiar?)!

    What about Narendra Modi?! He is recognized as a genocide perpetrator even by the US Immigrations who refuse him a visa to this day. Why not him?

    What about rabid hate mongers like Pravin Togadia? Aren’t their seditious speeches against the very tenets of tolerance and secularism?

    What about Lal Krishna Advani? His Rath Yatra adventure left a bloody trail of death and destruction wherever it went. Who’s to blame for all that?

    The Muslims of this country have long condemned and disowned every single action carried out in their name by the so called jehadis.. Why isn’t there then any pressure on the Hindus to disown these terrorists in saffron?

    It’s always easy to condemn the others because they’re different than you… but very difficult to admit that your own house is in disarray.

    As Indians, all the moderate, liberal voices of this nation needs to speak out in ONE voice – an INDIAN voice – and stop this growing bud of communalism and polarization from gaining any further ground.

    Jai Hind! (from a non-Indian well wisher!)

    • Nimmy
    • September 9th, 2008

    @Yaamyn,welcome:)

    Great comment..And indeed through too..

    “The Lashkar has access to sophisticated bombs that kill and maim civilians.. the Bajrang Dal, still in its terrorist infancy, just end up blowing themselves in their bomb factories”..lol..thatz very true and funny..But sad and g\dangerous for
    Inida..

    What I find it strange and annoying is that people are not satisfied even when muslims admit about having a group of fanatics in their group and denounce them,but that is not the same with VHP and Bjarang Dal..Why are they reluctant to admit that they have terrorits in their community???

    Yes,and as you said,secular and right people ahve to raise their vioce for a better India..

    Do visit again,Good day..

    @Arjun,I never said that the whole thing is propaganda..It is happening,but over hyped..Why can’t you accept the fact that many VHP and Dal people were killed and caught during bomb makiing and blasting training sessions????Do you want me to bring proof..Can you tell me why the person Raj Thackery is encouraging hindus to have suicide suaqds,to counter act jihadists..He is still sleeping in a/c room..Indeed secular Inida..Rememebr the petty reason why Abdul Nassar Madai was kept in jail for years and years..??Why don’t they apply the same law for Thackery too???Double standars..Are you aware of what Raj thackery has been ranting these days.??Still he has only been prohibitted from making public speeches..nothing more..Why isn’t he in jail,for working against national integrity uh?????

    • arjun2k
    • September 9th, 2008

    @Yaamyn, Nimmy,

    No secular peace loving person can defend the activities of Bajrang Dal and some factions VHP..There is no question about that…The problem comes, when they are the only one targeted by secular people….

    Coming to Raj Tackrey the same applies……

    Now coming to Abdul Nasser Maudani…Tell me who is responsible for keeping him in jail..Any Hindu organisation or Kunjalikutty and Muslim League who had vested interest to keep him in jail.Infact LA passed legislature for freeing him…Again I hope some of you might have heard some of his speeches.Anyway I have personally heard his speeches. I mean speeches before he was arrested….Those were terror spitting….

    Again dont think every Muslim is considered as a terrorist..
    Take Abdul Kalam..I believe he is the most repected person in India…
    Take Mahammad Hamid Ansari…Was there any problem in electing him as Vice president?

    India is one of the most secular country in the world.I believe its hugely because of large secular-Hindus..

    Can you tell me any country in the world which has

    Vice President- Minority community
    PM – Minority community
    Chairperson of ruling Alliance – Minority community
    Defence Minister – Minority Community

    These posts are among the 7 most powerful posts in India….

    Despite all these people say Hindus are against minorities…

    Let GOD save this country….

    • Nimmy
    • September 9th, 2008

    @Arjun ”

    The problem comes, when they are the only one targeted by secular people….”

    Very very wrong..Are you telling me that secular people don’t condemn acts by jihadists?where do you get your information from..Pls share..I can bring you loads of links where muslims,including scholars condemning terrorists acts..But i don’t see the same from your side..Did any priest of any other organization condemn VHP’s and Dal’s acts?If i am misinformed,pls enlighten me..

    “Coming to Raj Tackrey the same applies……”

    Then why is he still eating grapes and sleeping in his bunglow,instead of counting iron bars?Tell me why?

    “I mean speeches before he was arrested….Those were terror spitting….”..

    Agree,and that is why he deserved to be out in jail..But why isn’t it the smae with Raj thackery..Tell me why?????

    “India is one of the most secular country in the world.I believe its hugely because of large secular-Hindus”

    Again you are worng..India is the best country,bcoz of large number of secular indians..not becoz of hindus or muslims or christians..

    Do you think the the muslim oil money is less enough to hijack India?Do you think missionary money from West is less enough to highjack India? No no no..Infact even MPs in pariliment irrespective of cate and colour will sell india ..All they need is ‘some’ money..

    Instead it is bcoz of secualer and loyal people withstanding all this that India still remains the most beautiful antion in the world..You can’t simply make a pass by comment that its bcoz of you guys alone..By doing so,you are spitting at face of people like me..

    You can’t claim credit for what people like Kalam and Manmohan Singh acheived in their life..Are you telling me that they reached that position just bcoz hindu MAJORITY was kind enough,to give PERMISSION..Yo,thats very narrow thought..Sorry to say..

    Let GOD save this country….

    Yes,Let God save this country.. 🙂

    • arjun2k
    • September 9th, 2008

    “Did any priest of any other organization condemn VHP’s and Dal’s acts?”

    I would like to ask a question back…..Did you find any HINDU priest condemning the attack of Saraswati Lakshmanda..(Dont tell BJP and VHP) I didnt find any..That means they keep mum whatever happens…

    At the same time I found no so-called secular forces raising voices against killing of Lakshmanaanda…but so many anainst attack on nuns…

    “I too feel Raj Thackery should be put behind bars.Hope fully he will be arrested soon…There are so many leaders like him belonging to Hindu,Muslim Christian and Communist ideologies who shud be jailed…Only very few are getting arrested like Maudani and that too only with courtesy of people like Kunjalikutty

    “You can’t claim credit for what people like Kalam and Manmohan Singh acheived in their life..Are you telling me that they reached that position just bcoz hindu MAJORITY was kind enough,to give PERMISSION..Yo,thats very narrow thought..”

    Not a narrow thought,Just stressing there was no opposition for them to become the most respected…..Again u didnt answer me…Could you find any copuntry like this???????????????????????

    • Nimmy
    • September 9th, 2008

    @Arjun,I need answer you,but it is my STATEMENT that Inida is the best country..and i have said that many times..Why is it that you didn’t see it?

    At the same time I found no so-called secular forces raising voices against killing of Lakshmanaanda…but so many anainst attack on nuns

    I ask you back..Why there are few(in comparison) condemning violence against people in Iraq,Palastein and Afghanistan,while the world world talks against them when some people react back?Why?

    Not a narrow thought,Just stressing there was no opposition for them to become the most respected”..

    Do you think ‘opposition’ will help ?Intstead,they too will be sidelined if they work against national integrity..

    Arjun,I understand what you are saying..Yes,u r right…We should be impartial in dealing with all this ,as both you and me desire a better tomorrow for our country..Let us hold hands and work together ..Im not trying in anyway to justify to what blasters do..But i am very frustrated about sidelining a whole community in that name and that is why i get over-furious over your statements..I am sorry for over reacting..

    Good day

    • arjun2k
    • September 9th, 2008

    Y are u going international wen talking about national things…?

    I have put-forward my comments…Let the readers decide the facts

    🙂

    • Nimmy
    • September 9th, 2008

    Lol..maybe bcoz I feel it is the international stuff that create ripples all over the world…Most people accuse muslims of being terroists taking into consideration the international blasts..and that was what I was referring to..

    I think we were arguing too much..Lets wait for somebody else to put forward a new thought…

    • R.Sajan
    • October 11th, 2008

    I am with you all. Let us jointly try for a Hindu-free India.

    • R.Sajan
    • October 11th, 2008

    Adding:
    We need a Hindu-free India that would be Thy kingdom Come!.
    India can be divided among the 23 crores Moslems and 3 crores Christians. We would have as much freedom of religion and expression as we want under such dispensation. Look at great free countries like Pakistan, KSA, Iran, Israel etc. We would also be rich like them.

    Due to the propaganda after some of the 116000 converts in Khandmal killed that wretched Swami, the State government announced Rs. 2 lakhs each, and the Centre 3 Lakhs each to the victims. The 116000 converts would all be richer by 5 lakhs now. And imagine, the money would come from the pockets of the 800000000 Hindus; and not from our pockets. Calculate how much Rs 5 lakhs per head would amount to, to pay 116000 converts.[500000 X 116000]. The missions would get commission from it as well as added pourings-in from abroad in sympathy.

    In a Hindu-free India, all of us would be rich like this!

    • Amit
    • October 11th, 2008

    “I ask you back..Why there are few(in comparison) condemning violence against people in Iraq,Palastein and Afghanistan,while the world world talks against them when some people react back?”
    ===

    Are those the only three countries in the world outside India where some kind of injustice is happening? If the criteria is to criticize injustices, the list is going to be very long and include practically most countries in this world. So, what’s your logic in selecting those three? Why not also include B’desh, Nepal, Pakistan, Burma and China – our close neighbors where we can find plenty of instances of injustice to some group or the other. What makes the injustices in those three countries so special that it’s a cause of concern for Indian citizens?

    • Nimmy
    • October 12th, 2008

    Sajan,welcome 🙂

    Why do you assume that i want a hindu-free india..We already discussed on who a hindu is..I am a hindu too,just that i don’t follow hinduism..And by talkng about these terrorists,i don’t mean to eradicate hindus as a whole from the surface of this earth..By talking against jihadists,do you imply that all muslims whould be killed or thrown out of india?No rihgt?The same way,i am talking against all terrorists,so called islamic and hindu terrorists who dirupt normal functioning of scoiety by killing people..

    If you go through the comments,you can see that I am against the missionaries who expolit the tribal’s helplessness..But killing the missionaries doesn’t help the cause..You kill these 10 missionaries,100 more will come tomorrow..You kill the 100,1000 more will come next day and they will get more mileage by sympathy waves,and more resources in the form of money and manpower..Instead of killing,try to work on the tribal’s part and have setups for their food and health and education and all..You can see the whole of missionaries packing their back and leaving the place..all by themselves.

    You are happy,tribals are happy..and everything is fine and peaceful..

    But instead of that,raping and buring nuns and others will only upset the system more..Don’t you think this act will help draw more forigen funds?don’t you think this will lead them to ahve more sympathay and get more followers?Well,is that waht you want?No right?then please stop the barabrism and act wise..

    Regarding the money,i believe much more money is being wasted in political party’s protests by dmamgin public property and time and money…Leave aside all those money spent of religious travel packages spent on various sectors of people,and etc etc costs,a single day’s Bandh or Harthal will cost crores and the compensation given to these tribals is nothing when compared to the damage done by political partie’s strikes …So we need not worry about compensation..Atleast soembody is eating some food and wearing clothes using our tax and i am content with that..

    And pls tell me do you imply a muslim-free or christain-free india ,when you talk against jihadists? If not,i am also not implying to have to hindu-free india when i talk against hindu terrorists..I hope i made sense..

    Keep coming and share your views.All of us will benefit by sharing ideas..Good day..

    • Nimmy
    • October 12th, 2008

    @Amit,I have mentioned Iraq and Palastein only twice during the whole discussion.That too,in reference to a question..Quoting out of context distorts the intention,but never mind,I’ll share mt stand on this..

    I am not much bothered about what is happening in Pakistan and nepal and Burma,bcoz theirs is internal issues and it is for them to resolve their problems..But those in Iraq and Palastein and Leabonon are caused by external people..I never bothered about killing and problems in Iraq during times of Sadham and Lebonon,before isreal atatcked it..Bcoz that was their internal problem..I even don’t have anything against iran-iraq war ,again a mattar of nations sharing borders..LTTE too kills so many people,but not as many as world-police team does

    But i have issues and i am bothered about iraq,since when World police started bombing innocents,simply bcoz they wanted to ship oil..Err..i am diverting from the topic..

    I hope i made myself clear,WHY AS AN INDIAN CITIZEN IRAQ AND lEBONON MATTERS TO ME MORE THAN PAKISTAN AND NEPAL…and finally i am a least informed person and i know only about those issues that appear mostly in newspapers and i am sorry for not being aware of some afraican nations in trouble..and thatz why i don’t talk for them..Once i know more about ,i’ll surely for for justice-denied people..

    I hope you didn’t try to imply some religious aspects into this 🙂 Sorry for reading between lines,but i have seen far more non muslims than muslims,talking for justice-denied HUMAN BEINGS in Iraq and Palastein,bcoz it is not something they choose it,but the world-police team imposed one..

    Does that answer your doubt?

    • manoj
    • October 12th, 2008

    India is a liberal democratic nation. We had voting rights for women well before so many other nations. There is no point in distracting the argument in comparing it with theocratic nations of middle east.

  5. hey , nice blog , like it ,
    won’t be nice if i u can clickover to my blog page too ,
    & post some suggestion

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