Disclaimer..
I am looking back ..at myself.A dear friend of mine have given me a honest feedback and I realized that I went wrong in portraying myself through my words.. I realize that not only am I a pathetic writer, I also gave out wrong message to me readers.. I don’t know how can I erase those prejudices ,caused by my own reasons..
As she told me, whenever I make a comment, I equate it with Pakistan or Islamic jihadists thereby giving out the wrong unintended message that I am talking for them..
NO NO NO NO NO NO NO and NO.I am NOT talking for them..I am least bothered about Pakistan bcoz I have my own nation’s business to mind.. And not only that I hate holy war guys,I am also frustrated enough to blast them the same way as Nassrudhin Shah did it in ‘A Wednesday’.In fact I am so motivated by the movie ,that I am looking for a chance to make a unholy war against those holy war guys..
When I say I hate communal elements as vhp and Dal guys,I hate jihadists who are very much the other side of the same coin.I realize that I went wrong in putting it properly, the intended message.. I am not a good writer..And also,as another dear friend of mine said,I tend to approach things emotionally rather than rationally, that I am burst with emotions and words are flooded away and I end up giving the wrong message..Sorry ..I am never a supporter of bomb blasters in any sense
I need to be more mature in putting up my thoughts and not do it at the spur of a moment.. Words once said can’t be taken back and it takes more effort to erase out the wrong message sent..
Also, I have been thinking why am I so serious these days..I started this blog as a window to vent out some egos and frustrations of mine..lol..Now I think I am more egoistsic and frustrated..Sick..
I hope to have a fresh start. Maybe I need to brush up my cooking posts..Lot of photos waiting in the queue..lol..I am so obsessed with fighting and arguing with others that I am very lazy to divert away from the topic..But I think I need a break..
I am still sure that my intentions were and will always be true and sincere.. But then again,It is a fact that I went wrong in putting it properly.. Jumbled words are more destructive than being constructive in any way..
P.S :
I still stand by what I said, just that I admit that my words went wrong at times..And I’ld say it loud and clear that some of you are angry with me bcoz I talk against Hindu terrorists.. They are the same as bomb blasters and are two sides of the same coin..I’ll speak against them again again and again, in a more effective manner;-)
Nimmy's Experiment with Blogging 
But I hope you will not stop posting 🙂
My favorite posts of yours are those where you explain Islam to common Indian citizens, like in ‘Quran asks men to beat their wife’, and Muhammad was a pedophile’ etc.
And best is the one that made it to Blog Bharti.
Now I can see your brilliant award badge on the side bar 🙂
No dear..i am not stopping,rather correcting ..
Yes,even the first entry to blogbarti is my fav..Keep visiting
I appreciate that like many others you are an appreciator of peace and am glad that you would like to speak against violence. I do hope you are effective, I also plan to do the same thing as you, because violence is not the method that I believe in.
I do think that the bigger evil is Islam because of its extremely violent history and because it incites hate. Today many people dies in blasts in Delhi, and people continue to be motivated by Islamic sources. I have so far felt through my readings that Islam is the reason that they were like this. I would urge you to prove that this is not the case effectively because the misunderstanding is widespread. And I promise I will advertise your blog to everyone I can reach. You have an advantage of having good access to Quran and Hadiths, I can not make too much sense in either. We could effect a change this way, what say?
As for hindu terrorists, I think they are harmless, they can hardly do anything. They are rather stupid and intellectually bankrupt but they are harmless that way, they can never make sense in an argument, most of them.
You can disagree with me, your way to you and mine to me.
But regarding the Islamic thing, feel free to ban me or disagree with me, I have made my intentions clear, I would like to know how Islam is peaceful and why they are wrong, and if they are right in their interpretation of Islam, I would like to fight against this philosophy of hate.
For starters, if you are in agreement let me send the mail sent by Indian Mujahideen after recent blasts, please disprove the Islamic sources they have invoked for their hatred. If we can disprove their claims about Islam that they are following this can be published in some media so that a lot of people can understand the fallacy of these charges.
I would totally understand if you do not have the time, I do hope to find some believer who would teach me true Islam and I think I will.
@Another Kafir,
A terrorist is a terrorist & a terrorist-Period! it’s a mentally sick, deadly,harmful, anti-humanity creature-irrespective of caste,creed,religion & culture.
As for hindu terrorists, I think they are the only danger atleast to India(refer my take on them- Violence will be met with violence, Togadia warns on thi blog) & how about spending the same time & energy on the Gita,upanishad,vedas et al & leave Islam to it’s faithful, unless you doing some sort of research & working for a PHD on it, Duh.
Overall you have neither understood nor appreciated the honesty,magnanimity & sincerity of the host rather on the contrary you have leeched on her expense to push forward your Xenophobia & hateful agenda.
@Another Kafir, @nimmy
Indian is me.
Huh, did you delete it?????? for what??????
Keep blogging Nimmy. Here is a reader who understands your good intentions 🙂
Everything has to be quoted using a proper context. If terrorists quote the verses of the Holy Quran in support of their terrorist acts, it is necessary to read the exegesis of those verses. This will reveal that the terrorists are wrong.
However, the unfortunate fact of the matter is that very few people are taking affirmative action to ensure this
Ha ha Amma insaan,your other comment was awaiting moderation..Im not sitting here 24/7 buddy..I am a wife,a toddler’s mom and a home maker:)..pls give me some time..
will read all comments tomo and reply..good night to all
@ Milind, India;
Nimmy and I share the same morals; we condemn the bomb throwers; reject the Mullahs. But I’m surrounded by people who want to condemn Nimmy, and all Muslims. What can I tell these people?
We outsiders for whom the koran is not god’s word, desperately want NOT to condemn all the world’s Muslims because their book preaches terrorism. Our problem is that the exegesis given by the terrorists in support of their acts is far more convincing and logical than anything we hear from your side.
When I read the koran, it says exactly what the terrorists say it says. The bible also says that, but moderate christians don’t take their book literally; so I can speak out to defend moderate christians, but I need help to defend Nimmy, and you, and I hope, most Moslems of the world.
oops. sorry. lolkoran was me. Not a sockpuppet, just experimenting with blogging 🙂
Dude, Indian/Aam Insaan,
The reason I think the reason is Quran is because the terrorists are kind enough to tell us. The hindu terrorists may also be inspired by similar such thing, if you know the cause please address the issue yourself. Myself, I have not seen anyone quoting scripture to justify his killings and feel that they are plain frustrated and stupid, cruelly so.
Islam has been left to its faithful for long, I do not feel comfortable sitting around any longer, I like to take action and do something. The terrorists are using Quran as their justification, I plan to disprove them.
“Overall you have neither understood nor appreciated the honesty,magnanimity & sincerity of the host rather on the contrary you have leeched on her expense to push forward your Xenophobia & hateful agenda.”
On the contrary, I very much appreciate the honesty, magnanimity and sincerity of Nimitha, which is why I made the request. I would like to know why you consider this xenophobia and hateful. I do not dislike the people who are terrorists but I would like to talk them out of it. Still may be there is something that makes me hateful. If Nimitha should think so, I will leave as soon as she asks me to.
Ak,
I appreciate and thank you for your constructive contribution to my blog and making it more interesting..I hope to reciprocate in the same level..
I guess you are reffering to “Islam was spread by sword”:)
It is true that there had been many wars,but unless one cherry picks the incidents,I don’t think there is anything out of course than any other history.Prophet(pbuh) had many wars with neighbouring tribes,as they were always attchking him and his people..So i guess,as any other normal person,he too retaliated for the security of his land and people,and of cource faith..See,i am not blinding myslef to the incidents where captives were asked to change religion..Its all so complicated and i have not read much onit..In short,I agree there had been wars,but not for speading religion,but as self protection..
“Indonesia is the country that has the largest number of Muslims in the world, and the majority of people in Malaysia are Muslims. But, no Muslim army ever went to Indonesia or Malaysia. It is an established historical fact that Indonesia entered Islam not due to war, but because of its moral message. Despite the disappearance of Islamic government from many regions once ruled by it, their original inhabitants have remained Muslims. Moreover, they carried the message of truth, inviting others to it as well, and in so doing endured harm, affliction and oppression. The same can be said for those in the regions of Syria and Jordan, Egypt, Iraq, North Africa, Asia, the Balkans and in Spain. This shows that the effect of Islam on the population was one of moral conviction, in contrast to occupation by western colonialists, finally compelled to leave lands whose peoples held only memories of affliction, sorrow, subjugation and oppression.
http://www.newmuslimguide.com/en/articles/was-islam-spread-by-the-sword-.html”
We may talk about war later;-)
I take up your suggestion..I wish i can do some justice from my part..Pls give me some time..I need to get that crappy letter first..
What crap. .I am not silly enough to do that..Only once i deleted one comment from a friend of mine and i am sorry for doing so,bcoz that wasn’t any hurtful or offensive..i did a mistake in the spur of a moment,and wordpres don’t allow me to correct my mistake..Deleted comment is gone for ever..
So,pls continue being here..
@Indian,
Exactly..In my opinion,terrorism is a religion in itself as they ahve their own ideologies and explanations and methods of propogating it..Thanks for supporting;-)
And pls don’t yell at me for my past mistake..Since from a new username,the comment went into moderation..and hence took time to appear..
Thanks Nimitha, I asked for myself to be banned in case I was being leeching on your expense as suggested by the others. You can email me I have that letter sent by Indian Mujahideen, the one after Ahmedabad. The delhi one I am still looking for.
Ak,I feel you are someone i know…hmm…Where did u get ‘Nimitha’ from????
@Watercat,I agee that non-muslims don’t care what Quran says bcoz it is not their concern..What matters to them is what people do..I realize things went wrong in many cases .But I still stand with my argument that it is not the religion,but its followers who are wrong..Pls hang in for some more time as i hope to make some contributions in that direction..Good day..
@cris..thanks dear..((hugs))
@Milind,,yes ,you are right..The fact stands that some muslims are spiritualy misinformed and sadly more muslims are dangerously silent..We need to talk out to justify ourselves..
If somebody wants to read the very best commentaries available on the Holy Quran that I know of, I would cite two:
1 > By S.V.Mir Ahmed Ali with notes by Ayatollah Agha Pooya Yazdi.
2 > By Abdullah Yusuf Ali.
These are scholars of repute, and sober people.
However, if they do not have the time to do that, they should seek opinions from contemporary scholars rather than the usual mullahs.
No you do not know me, I would rather keep my identity a secret anyway, I love life. I got Nimitha from another commenter.
//burst with emotions and words are flooded away and I end up giving the wrong message..Sorry ..I am never a supporter of bomb blasters in any sense//
Nimmy, just a quick comment. I have been following your blog for a few weeks. Although you have written emotionally, not once did I ever feel that you had condoned any bomb blasts. If anyone ever took away that impression from your blog posts, they weren’t reading right.
Mummyjaan,thanks for your words..But lately i have been getting comments on me being racist and communal and just one sided… 🙂
@Another Kafir
Terrorists are like cancerous cells & whether you like them or dislike them doesn’t matter much, but you do eliminate them to keep the rest of the body healthy, alive & kicking- on the flip side, it’s also true that the society is solely responsible for their unhealthy growth, therefore rather than disowning them & shirking it’s responsibility as if cancer happens on it’ own- it must owe up to it first, & then & then, only, can we judiciously & collectively take precautions to prevent their recurrence & not let this terrorism legacy to be passed on to our future generations as a hereditary disease.
your quotes-
-‘terrorists are using Quran as their justification’-‘reason is Quran’
-‘hindu terrorists may also be inspired by similar such thing’- ‘Myself, I have not seen anyone quoting scripture’
‘if you know the cause please address the issue’
what’s there to ‘address you have already addressed it yourself – let me frame your sentence appropriately for you.
‘I think the reason & the brains behind the muslim terrorists using the Quran as their justification is their personal greed for power & sadistic authoritarian control over the common masses & are stupid enough to tell us so, just because a handful of morons believe in their so called ‘cause’, the hindu terrorists are desperately searching for such similar ‘inspirations’ (sic) & thus upon failing to find anything of this sort to justify their actions in our scriptures, as all justifications at end of the day are wrong or else why resort to justify right action? huh? Nevertheless they engage in their vicious brand of hindutatva terrorism because terrorist are terrorist, same as cancer is cancer- lymphatic cancer or any other phobic cancer-period!’
Further, if there is any damage being done by misinterpretations& falsified justifications to the name & purity of Islam, leave it to it’s true followers to take counter step as they deem fit, no need of you to feel discomfort, relax, religion is a private affair, only & only if they ask support as fellow citizens, be honoured to join them in their brave endeavour, by all mean in an proper civilized manner.
And this- “I”- like to take action and do something- bit- is the seed from which spring all terrorists!
India is a mighty & sovereign country, with a valid constitution & an effective judiciary & above all a vibrant democracy, if at all you wish to ‘take action’, ‘do something’, you are most welcome to take all civilized routes -the political, social activist etc.
I hope I have addressed the ‘cause’ to your satisfaction also. Amen.
As far as I understood Nimmy’s disclaimer is an attempt for space & clarification of misunderstandings of her genuine feelings, rest is for her to speak.
You have not addressed why you think that it is xenophobic and hateful.
“‘I think the reason & the brains behind the muslim terrorists using the Quran as their justification is their personal greed for power & sadistic authoritarian control over the common masses & are stupid enough to tell us so, just because a handful of morons believe in their so called ‘cause’”
You were using quotation marks all over the place, a bit confusing. Anyway, you totally wrote down in words what I feel about religion in general. They are not being stupid in telling us that Quran is their reason, they are being sincere. Its not as simplistic as you put it, their source of inspiration is the religion you can make out when you read it.
And yet I am not stupid to just start blaming the Quran, I have been reading and trying to understand it myself. Aside from being not so easy to understand, I have not found many signs of misinterpretation. What if it is not misinterpretation but Islam is actually a decree of hate, would you feel comfortable in your silence. I would not, I would like to point it out and let everyone know. I would like that people reject the violent parts and disprove them or to reject the religion itself. That is what I mean by taking action. I respect the laws and am glad about the free speech, hence I use only free speech for this. Read my comment. – https://nimis540.wordpress.com/2008/09/13/serial-blasts-hits-delhi-18-dead/#comment-500
“Further, if there is any damage being done by misinterpretations& falsified justifications to the name & purity of Islam, leave it to it’s true followers to take counter step as they deem fit, no need of you to feel discomfort, relax, religion is a private affair, only & only if they ask support as fellow citizens, be honoured to join them in their brave endeavour, by all mean in an proper civilized manner.”
I disagree, I do feel discomfort because innocents like me are the ones who die. I will not act only when I am asked to because when you are attacked you may not have the time to call me for help and I may not be able to help you. Only foolish people dig the well when there is drought. When random innocents are under attack, I too am already under the radar and I will fight terror as I deem right, within the allowable frameworks of the constitution. Religion is otherwise a private affair, no doubt, but when someone plants a bomb in your backyard in name of religion then I do wish to question the basis of his attack. Even if my government wishes to be silent on the part of the citizens I do not shirk away from the responsibility to question the basis of terrorism.
“Terrorists are like cancerous cells & whether you like them or dislike them doesn’t matter much,”
I do not like any terrorists, I have never said that. But I like to dislike terrorism more than I dislike terrorists. I feel that most of the hindu “terrorists” are stupid, frustrated lot who do not know the constitutional valid frameworks to espouse a cause and oppose a certain one. The Islamist terrorists on the other hand are far more violent and dangerous.
Still as I said, you should and will be doing a good thing by speaking against terrorism “in general”.
In your next comment please tell me how questioning Islam as the basis of terrorism is xenophobic and hateful and also please tell me why this is the basis of terrorism.
By Allah, We verily sent messengers unto the nations before thee, but the devil made their deeds fairseeming unto them. So he is their patron this day, and theirs will be a painful doom. (Holy Quran 16:63)
When you see the above verse, you realize that the terrorists are misguided, even if they state that the Quran is the basis for their terrorism.
This is as far as the gullible ones are concerned. The masterminds do not believe in Islam at all, for them terrorism is pure commerce.
@Nimmy
I agree that there is nothing much fundamentally wrong with Islam. A relegion would be known by its followers and sadly a few misguided people are giving it a bad name. However the moderates need to spread awareness about the religion not only amongst non Muslims but also among Muslims to stop mis interpretation of verses, which results in terrorist activities.
Keep writing 🙂
PS: Spamming a comment would be a better option than deletion. Spammed comments are only visible to the blog writer.
I will go one step further and say that one has to disprove the violent verses completely and nothing short of that will adequately hold these terrorists back. MJ Akbar does a good job in showing the moderate side of Islam. But until these are disproven there is not much point in the exercise and there may not be much difference by doing it.
@Another Kafir
Duffer, the ‘confusing’ quote are the one that you have written- go above & read the idiotic crap that you write & forget & confuse yourself at your own expense – not mine.
Become a rabble rousing mullah or a hindu terrorist- Meri ballah se-
“Gyani se Gyani mile
Hoye Ras ki loota loot
Gyani se Agyani mile
Hoye matha- koot”
—–So kahegaye Sant Kabir.
Thanks very much Aam Insaan, I actually took your advice and read everything, thanks for the superlative display of civility in your tone. I shall remain grateful unto you for showing me the way to become a rabble rousing mullah or a hindu terrorist. I realise that your goal and my goal are different, I plan to fight terror and you like to ask people to become terrorists.
@AK,
Providing the right interpretation of the verses alone will not help.
The Ummah has to stand up and declare loud and clear that the terrorists are not part of them.
It may be a good idea for the Hindu community to do this regarding the VHP and Bajrang Dal
Milind, I am not in agreement with you, it would be wrong to remove them from society or alienate them. I think it is adequate that they be corrected and be shown the right path. Of course, justice of their past deeds should also meet them. I think by delinking from them we wont be solving anything. They think they are doing good for the muslim society, thats good, lets show them whats good for the muslim society. Same for VHP of Bajrang Dal.
What I think we should do is to disprove them conclusively so that they shall not again err in their interpretation. Also we should reject violence as a means for doing anything, they are welcome to adopt any cause they want to withing democratic frameworks. I do not wish to reject them simply because they do not conform to my taste let people decide that.
@Aam Insaan
I think the reason & the brains behind the muslim terrorists using the Quran as their justification is their personal greed for power & sadistic authoritarian control over the common masses & are stupid enough to tell us so, just because a handful of morons believe in their so called ‘cause..
Couldn’t have said it better myslef..Thanks for that..
India is a mighty & sovereign country, with a valid constitution & an effective judiciary & above all a vibrant democracy, if at all you wish to ‘take action’, ‘do something’, you are most welcome to take all civilized routes -the political, social activist etc.
I agree 100%,except with ‘effective judiciary’..Jusitce delayed is justice denied..
And finally,sorry i don’t any bit of your last doha(i hope that is the right word..Recall something like that in my 8th std hindi lessons)..Good day..Pls keep visiting..
@Another Kafir,
Listen to yourself carefully, you speak the same language that the terrorist speaks, now you think like a terrorist-then you shall act like one & the high light is that terrorists also want us to behave in a civil manner with them, hypocrites.
Ak,I very much appreciate your effort to know the real islam..
Sorry to interfere,but i think there is misunderstanding between you and Aam insaan..As far as i understand it,all of us have a same goal,but always remember that we are different people with different attitudes,which would obviously eflect in what we say..Nobody is preaching hatred here and bashing islam..We are doing it in a respectful way and lets continue doing so..
Great thought..May we all reach our goals soon..
Its great to talk about islam to somebody who unnderstands the realistic grounds..Thanks for sharing your thoughts and keep contributing..Good day to you…
@India unbound,:-) long time no see..
. A relegion would be known by its followers and sadly a few misguided people are giving it a bad name..
Exactly..People in general don’t care what Quran says,but what muslims do..there need to be lot of effort in the right direction ,especially from muslims part..
Yeah i know about making comments as spam..But the deletion as an intentional one,but turned mistake..lol..
Aam Insaan,
Please show me which comments of mine are the similar to the conversations you have had with terrorists or the comments you have heard of terrorists.
If I am wrong everyone needs to know about it, including myself. Quote me and make a stronger case against me, let everyone know and reject me for it. I am not daring you, I am serious, you are making a faulty claim and not even backing it with evidence.
@AK,
If the people concerned can be reformed, that would be the best possible thing.
However, that does not usually happen, which is why I was suggesting the course that I was.
@Another Kafir
Alright, first the genesis of terrorism, during the cold war era when Russia invaded Afghanistan, the western powers as usual wanted us, according to them, the lowly Asians, to fight their war- & obviously they found a ready partner in Pakistan, together they created the monster Taliban (incidentally the Saudi Prince, now the prince of terror, Osama bin laden who is a thorn in the eye of the western powers, not too long ago was their blue-eyed boy, their very own creation, lol) Islam religion was made the scapegoat for greed & power by vested interests, so there’s nothing religious about terrorism- then the end of cold war, Russia collapses, so end of financial & arms support of Taliban, who were then discarded by the westerners as toilet paper,& now both the westerners & Pakistan, they are fighting their own created monster, no sympathies for them from me atleast, rather they deserve it.
Now I shall draw the parallel between the Taliban & it’s offshoots & the RSS brigade with whom you sympathize & call harmless & speak a similar language.
Taliban: In the name of Islam.
RSS & you: Against the name of Islam.
Common thread – justifying in the name of Islam, for or against how does it matter? huh??? They look into it to excuse their sadistic actions & you look into it to gleefully authorize & validate their claims for self-justification (the evidence is your various statements) –
1-‘Dude, Indian/Aam Insaan,
The reason I think the reason is Quran is because the terrorists are kind enough to tell us.’
2-‘I do think that the bigger evil is Islam because of its extremely violent history and because it incites hate.’
3-‘I would like to fight against this philosophy of hate.’
4-‘but Islam is actually a decree of hate,’
The evidence is splattered all over this blog by you by scores of similar statements.
—aren’t these above quotes of yours xenophobic & full of hate? Thus you are trying to justify & obtain a ‘terrorist license’ to fight terror with terror as per your interpretation.
5-You:- ‘As for hindu terrorists, I think they are harmless, they can hardly do anything. They are rather stupid and intellectually bankrupt but they are harmless that way, they can never make sense in an argument, most of them.’
evidence–you are desperately trying to intellectually enhance & make sense of their argument, although with little success.
6-You- ‘I do not dislike the people who are terrorists but I would like to talk them (out of it).’
7-‘They are not being stupid in telling us that Quran is their reason, they are being sincere.’
—evidence- overall deep within, you do respect & regard their so called commitment for their ‘cause’ & wish to imply their methods & imitate them, they are the source of inspiration for your own hypothetical ‘cause.’-
jehadi recruits mission:- ‘Islam has been neglected by it’s faithful for long, I do not feel comfortable sitting around any longer, I like to take action and do something.’
Evidence, an identical viewpoint from you—-
8-Your mission: ‘Islam has been left to its faithful for long, I do not feel comfortable sitting around any longer, I like to take action and do something.’
You: ‘I too am already under the radar and I will fight terror as I deem right,’
this statement of your suggests that you are under undue self imposed mental stress , relax.
And I say all this to you because I care; any one-upmanship game is not my intention.
Dude thanks, I did not know that RSS was against Islam, I think I will join them. 😛 In fact I have interacted with them and here are my thoughts about them. They do not wish to raise any uncomfortable questions if it may offend anyone but they are ready to stick together and fight if it is necessary. I find that dumb, fighting should be the last resort. They can not speak against Islam but they will speak against the muslims and their behaviour. Me, I am different, I speak against and ask for introspection in Islam and I absolutely love muslims, who are humans like all of us.
I said it and I will repeat it, I do wish to fight terror, I wish to question its foundations, I see nothing wrong with fighting terror. I do think at this point of time that Islam is a decree of hate. There are several reasons and I wish to explore the subject further.
As for the origins of terror, you are right, that is the origin of terror in Afganistan. India has been facing terror strikes in Kashmir for a long time and Israel has been facing a number of terror strikes since its inception. Even the premier of Egypt was not spared because he attempted to strike peace with Israel. It would be naive to limit the origins of terror in Afganistan. Have you read the kind of wars fought during Muhammed’s time, they were equally terrifying.
I still do not think what I said was xenophobic, which means ‘fear or hatred of the foreign’ and yes they are hateful of an ideology. The same way you and I hate hindutva, I find many things repulsive with the violent Islam.
As for hindu terrorists, I limit my understanding to the Rss dudes I have met, and my understanding is that they are trying to vent the frustration of some actual things and other imagined things and they know absolutely no constitutional ways of doing anything. They do not think and hence will not have an argument.
And all along I do not wish to fight people, I wish to bring them to light and reject hatred and live in harmony. How did you imply that I want to emulate their methods and imitate them? Yes they are the source of my inspiration for my cause but that is because they are miscreants and their foundations need to be questioned, which I will do.
Also dude, how can the jehadi viewpoint be that they will take action and question the faithful on their faith? Debating on ideas is a scholarly thing, that is my idea of action, the Al Qaeda or mujahideen are on the other end of spectrum, they speak with their guns.
About the mental stress, you are right, I feel very bad when such incidents happen. Still by all standards I am quite relaxed, I am more ruffled with other everyday things. Yet my psychology should be a subject of discussion for a different forum.
I think we have both provided opposing viewpoints, let people decide for themselves, brickbats are most welcome. The ones who have to understand out viewpoints will have understood by now. Lets not use up this forum for more side debates.
If Aam Insaan, you or any others want to ask me further on any of these issue please mail me anotherkafir@yahoo.in
Your mails are most welcome, I assure you I am not a terrorist. 🙂
[i]Alright, first the genesis of terrorism, during the cold war era when Russia invaded Afghanistan, the western powers as usual wanted us, according to them, the lowly Asians, to fight their war- & obviously they found a ready partner in Pakistan, together they created the monster Taliban (incidentally the Saudi Prince, now the prince of terror, Osama bin laden who is a thorn in the eye of the western powers, not too long ago was their blue-eyed boy, their very own creation, lol) Islam religion was made the scapegoat for greed & power by vested interests, so there’s nothing religious about terrorism- then the end of cold war, Russia collapses, so end of financial & arms support of Taliban, who were then discarded by the westerners as toilet paper,& now both the westerners & Pakistan, they are fighting their own created monster, no sympathies for them from me atleast, rather they deserve it.[/i][\i]
Some twisted logic there, Osama may have any history in the past, the people he killed had not wronged him in any manner. Thousands of innocent people died simply because they lived and worked in America. And they deserved it because Bush was foolish to play with fire earlier on? How can innocent Indians who simply worked there have deserved to die in the attack on America? What happened on 9/11 was rather a shameful and dastardly act, and it was definitely not deserved by the people. By your logic it would be right to kill innocent muslims because they belong the same religion as Osama and Aurangzeb. It is you who is speaking like a terrorist now.
Aam Insaan is arguing that he has no sympathy for the people western forces and Pakistan who suffering from terror because they are the ones who created the terror in the first place.
The actual picture of RSS that i carry and was describing is that they are more against people than against the idea, they would much rather fight with muslims without questioning for an instance their ideology of hate.
I do not belong or agree with RSS on most issues, I urge for me to be spared in this discussion. I am very happy if you make these into posts (I know some of these are from posts) and incriminate them, I have nothing to do with them and please refrain from calling it my co-ideologists etc. I find a lot wrong in Islam and question it, period. No more no less.
I have not said that I agree with them or that I want to join hands with them except in jest.
Why are you breaking your own rule and reading between the lines? The Al-Qaeda statement was in response to the comparison drawn between me and terrorists.
I feel it is best to fight terror period, if they think they are doing it or not it is their business. I think it was a colossal mistake to kill Gandhiji and I have never preached violent ways of doing things.
If you insist on more brickbats please do it on my mail and please do think of what you are saying and read my comments before saying it.
My thoughts about RSS and VHP are the same as your thoughts about Khomeini, I know little about them and I do not like my name to associated with them.
I am really surprised by your comment, when did I proudly support them? I have only asked for them to be questioned for their wrongs too. I maintain a humanitarian stance towards all violent groups, if they realise their mistakes and make amends to walk on the right path, I have no problems with them.
I am sorry this is my last comment here.
You-‘Some twisted logic there,’ lol, — look who’s talking!
You are mentally stuck! Read the whole Para again & again, not in a religious sense but in a global political & historical sense, with an unbiased mindset of the actual scenario.
In the above cited context & in the present day unfolding scenario & incidents happening, the tripartite messed up war amongst the Nato, Taliban & Pakistan, it’s their own created mess & let them clean it up themselves for all I care, neither am I concerned, it’s for their citizens to stop this madness which when they supported & sympathized with their rabble rousers & war mongering politicians, when the going seemed good for them & they fell prey, so first & foremost they should be willing & honest enough to shoulder this responsibility rather than blindly shrieking ‘murder’ as if they were not a part of the encouragement process, What else did the westerners & Pakistanis’ expect? huh?
Yes! I stand by my statement, & shall voice my opinion against the Hindu Taliban force in the making- The RSS brigade & you who are it’s sympathizers & your perverted so called causes, missions & ideologies (sic) ultimately & invariably it lead to the ‘gun culture’, no concessions here, amazingly similar ingredients & ideologies which were required to give birth to Taliban & same material being used by the RSS brigade & also by Indian Muslim groups to create Indian clones of Taliban-‘SIMI’ ‘Indian Mujahidin’ so on & so forth, & there is no shortage of ‘Aam Adami’ sympathizers for them also, rather their support base is growing by the day, i.e. I mean for both the sides & this I say, because, if not checked in time, then I shall have in the same manner no kind words or compassion for the mayhem & civil war that shall ensue in future. Therefore the ‘Aam Adami’ everywhere is to some extent responsible for either nipping the monster in it’s bud or letting it prosper & strengthen amongst them. or else suffer like the afghani on whose land foreign wars are being fought, their fault, in their ignorance & initial trust due to religious affinities, they entertained the Taliban & Pakistan after Russians left, whereas Pakistan had sinister design with regard to Afghanistan- the Punjabi feudal lords who rule Pakistan claim that Afghanistan is also their fiefdom & it must be ruled by them.
Israel- Palestine conflict is a war amongst nations not terrorism as was the Ireland – British conflict; they did not spill out in unrelated territories nor are their goals & objectives similar to Taliban & RSS who masquerade as moral brigades & ‘conscious keepers’ of society & so no need of unnecessary confusions of terminologies.
With your logic the freedom fighters of India would also be termed as terrorist; do you agree with the Englishmen? The Jan sangh (now RSS) & the communists supported the British rule in India.
Do you still claim not being a RSS co-ideologist? WAKE UP!
Ak,I am sorry if i read between lines.I was responding to your last commentt,”Dude thanks, I did not know that RSS was against Islam, I think I will join them. ” which is really a surprising one from your part ..Instead of correcting and disagreeing,i don’t know why are you leaving offended..You are free to leave when you get bored ,but its bad to leave offended..
@Another Kafir
..and throughtout your statements,you seem to convey the message that RSS and allies are not very dangerous..How is that true?Am i reading bwteen lines? Jihadists blast bombs and kill people..RSS rape preganat ladies in roads and tear their vagina and womb ..burn kids alive..is that less dangerous?
I think jihadists are better bcoz they attack from darkness and we are unawre of it..Waiting for death in front of swords,and watching your wife and mother and daughter getting raped in front of you is more evil and horrible..
There is no point in comapring both..There is no ‘less evil”
Evil is evil..period..Youy may disagree..but i find jihadists and RSS+allies equally evil and are two sides of same coin
I did not mean that I was leaving in the sense of leaving, I meant that I had posted three comments in a row and I should stop ranting.
I see no point in comparing the two either, that is why I have never tried to defend the RSS or VHP in any of your other posts. On the contrary I have supported your stance.
What I said about joining them was in jest and not a serious comment.
@Aam Insaan, the Israel Palestine conflict may have been a political one, but the problem with terrorism is that it attacks innocents un-announced. That should be opposed, period. Whether the group had some problem with the people of the country they were attacking or not, I do not think is relevant, to attack innocents is wrong, and that is where I do not join hands in “not sympathising” for terror victims.
I have not asked you to change your stance on the hindu terrorists in the making and I have not even objected to it. I merely offer my views and understanding on the subject. You can oppose whomsoever you wish to, as long as you are constitutional in your means.
Aam Aadmi, please continue your rejoinder against me in my mail box, you would be most welcome. I think this forum is not for that purpose.
Ak,
In that case,i delete my reply 🙂
Ak, I am fraid you are not understanding Aan inssan’s comemnt in the right spirit..See,most of the muslim terrorists come from politically unrest areas of the world..Mayit be Palastein,amy it be Iraq, or Afghanistan of Bosnia..They ahve their own reasons..I am proud to sympathize with their cause,but not their method..I’ld not have felt bad if they go and bomb the leaders who are responsible for thier sufferings,but sadly they are opting to fight against innocent people..
The immense support these guys get,makes us look further into their real cause..Nobody,even a grandpa of 134 yrs old is willing to die..So,when people opt to give up lives,maybe they ahve their own strong convictions..I can’t say that i’ll not take law in my hands if such brutality happens to me or my dear ones..I don’t think wearing a white dress and waving white flags and marching to leader’s offices will help me and those suffering..So,maybe the only choice left out would be to atke law in my own hands and react..I guess these maybe the thinkings of people who have lost all hope and are desperate..We can amke comments easily bcoz we are not going thru such things..In no way,am i justifying killing innocent people..But the only justification is can find from their part is this..
My husband was telling me about his old friends who are now SIMI activists..He said,There were many gangsters in the area who were picking on and ruining peaceful lives if villagers..They gave complaint to all authorities ,but nobody would take any action as this ganster was their ‘friend’..No politicians,nobody helped..Not able to withstand the torture,one day,this person(my husband’s friend) wne and cut a hand off the gangster,the main leader..Its been years,but nobody ,no gunda has come again to disrupt peace of that village..The SIMI friend became a person with criminal record,but bcoz of him,a whole vilage is in peace..
After hearing this,I didn’t know what to reply..It is true that he did take law in his hands and acted violently,but was there a choice left,as none of the police and politicians helped..?If that hadn;t happened,maybe the village would have still been in the arms of mor n more gangsters. I don’t know who did right and wrong..
I just shared this tory to tell that theer are underlying causes that enable terrorits to operate esily with the help of local people..Unless we remove these causes,this is not going to end any day..The chain of you questioning verses and me explaining it is going to be a unfruitful discussion..
I understand people taking law into their own hands, but I do not understand the reason to join a violent movement like SIMI, which is a religious movement completely. The problem again comes back to Quran, the Quran says that the muslims are given permission to fight because they are wronged. In other words the Quran is trying to make use of their resentment to forward their religious cause.
I know that there are several reasons that cause people to go against the state and even kill innocents, the people who go and join these terrorists are not as much to blame as the people running these organisations. They are the ones who run it based on Islamic concepts. It is them that need to be disproved, and the musilm society so that they do not fall prey to this.
To end terrorism would mean perfect governance and that would be rather impossible actually.
The muslims are soft targets because of several concepts like hijra, ummah and all. Besides the kind of verses that are there in Quran make people believe that they are getting a raw deal even if they are not. Pakistani muslims were not being persecuted en-mass, there were riots but that was both ways. What prompted them to make a separate nation? The muslims of Kashmir are susceptible to falling prey to Pakistan because they are muslim and they want a ummah to stick together. I happened to go over a folder of Islamic files in salafi manhaj and it says that a hijra is mandatory for all muslims in non-muslims towards muslim countries.
On the larger subject of why it is necessary to question religion, I will say that it has a moderating effect on religion. I read these concepts in this sira that I have downloaded, and I am surprised that this book has not entered controversy, I am surprised that the people of the muslim society who read it did not cringe when they read that the fight was to continue until all worship was for allah. I am surprised that they did not cringe at the violent ways of the muslim tribe at that time. Instead this author was given the first prize as the best sira.
I am surprised that the Islamic authors were not beaten when they said that the Quran allows beating of the wife. There are more instances and I think the muslim society has failed humanity in many ways. All questions are being answered only when they are being questioned by non-muslims and the westerners.
The questioning of these concepts will improvise the Islamic understanding of these things or make it more moderate.
@AK,
If the Muslim society has (as you say) failed humanity in many ways, would you like to support Muslims who are genuinely keen on working towards peace and harmony?
If yes, do you believe that the route is by belittling their book and deriding their beliefs?
If you say that the Muslims display intolerance, is this not intolerance too? Be fair.
It would be intolerance if my mission was to belittle the Quran.
I am only pointing out what is already in there and asking for introspection. I know you have great respect for women, then why don’t you condemn the beating verse instead of saying that no one will put it into practice.
Instead of condemning the violence in Quran why do you cherry pick the peaceful verses?
I am definitely open to working with peaceful people but I do not think it is peaceful to preach peace and not condemn the violence just because it appears in your holy book. That applies to the peaceful muslims too.
You can continue to twist Islam till it conforms to your morality or you can leave it. I do not mind either, except that the first kind should encourage further debate. If debate is not encouraged, speech is not free then the violence is allowed to continue and it is equivalent of shielding a criminal.
Besides Milind, Speaking of Belittling their book and deriding their beliefs, what is the record of Quran on this? According to Quran and most interpreters a kafir like me should be killed. Mohammed belittled the jews to be pigs and apes, he broke all the idols which were existing in the kaaba after conquering it. He called the christians guilty of the gravest sin of shirk. The idolaters and other religion people were expected to pay a protection tax in humiliation, feeling degraded.
There is no dearth of hate speech in Quran. If I am intolerant in logically questioning some verses in Quran, Mohammed is knee deep into intolerance for inciting hatred and violence towards people of other religion.
Hi,
thanks for posting that much, I hope many people would know alot good about Islam than what they traditionally have known about it.
Islam is a religion of peace and you are proving it by your attempt of bringing peace among Muslims and non-Muslims. And the person above me is saying that a kafir like him should be killed, so I think Islam never askes to kill someone for not believing in Islam. Islam asks us to treat every human well and the thought should be to give a good impression of what Islam makes a Muslim. Of course people Like those who are killing innocent people in the name of Islam are not surely practicing Islam the way it says. Killing one person means killing a whole community, thats what Islam says. So how can a person be a good Muslim killing so many innocent people, and that on the name of religion.
Thanks for your blog sister, keep it up, Allah has much reward for you.
Ramadan Mubarak!
Also Good Luck Inshallah!
“At last Victory is always of the Truth!”
Thanks for your nice words sister.. 🙂 Keep coming and do give suggestions and criticisms..Peace.
@Ski,
I really liked what you have posted. Islam is indeed a religion of peace. Also, those who carry out terrorist activities in the name of Islam are not real Muslims at all.
The important thing for the Muslim community is NOT TO GET PROVOKED.
Keep posting. You are bringing good things to the table.
I am sorry, I noticed only now that I was being responded to. And yes, apostasy is a crime in Islamic Law. Muhammed had said “The blood of a Muslim person is not permissible to be shed except a man who is an aduterer after he has preserved himself from zinaa, or commits disbelief after Islaam or when taking a soul for a soul.” This is from sahih bukhari, Uthmaan said.
And yes, may truth win.
The Quran clearly states that there is no compulsion in religion.
However, there was an ordinance promulgated outside of the Quran that made apostasy a capital offense. That was for political reasons that it was necessitated.
Milind, I was equally delighted when I had read that in the Quran. That is the single most progressive thing I find in the Quran, apart from the wonderful treatment of the orphans and all. But I have seen many many Islamic sources that still quote Mohammed with the above. It is from the sahih hadith of Bukhari. Probably as a shia (am I right?) you do not agree with Bukhari.
What is the meaning of saying one thing and doing another? What do you think has more meaning?
I will contend that it is the doing that makes more difference as we know that in Islamic countries they have been punishing or executing the apostates for ever since Mohammed or since Islam came to them. The doing in this case was so strong to overpower the word of God on the freedom of religion.
@AK,
Although I follow the Shia aqeeda, I do not let it be a barrier when interacting with other Muslims. And I do not let religion be a barrier when interacting with Non Muslims. AT THE HUMAN LEVEL, WE HAVE TO TREAT EVERYBODY EQUALLY.
The political exigency that necessitated this ordinance of death penalty for apostasy is that when enemy troops were faced with death, they superficially embraced Islam to only renounce it later. This created a difficult situation for the nascent Muslim community.
Today, this situation no longer obtains, hence this fatwa promulgated under a situation of emergency no longer holds good.
Ak,Milind,
Hanging apostates is the biggest hipocracy in present day’s Isamic laws..
Allah makes it clear in Quran that there is no compulsion in religion..How come scholars act moral police,higher than Allah himself..
The killing of apostates during Muhammad’s time was due to them conspiring and fighting against muslims,after they left Islam..i.e,they were punished for their later crimes and not for leaving islam..Allah is not sitting there counting the number of muslims leaving in and out of Islam..He has made it clear in Quran,and there is nothing,no hadith ,no scholar ,not even the Prophet,who is above Quran and can override the laws in it..
I have read lot on this..I hope to bring some sources,maybe in a new post..
@Nimmy,
I completely agree with you. When God has unequivocally stated in the Quran that there is no compulsion in religion, nobody has the right today to overrule Him.
Apostates during the Holy Prophet’s time were indeed killed for the reason you maintained.
Hi Nimmy, Milind,
Here are some articles on apostasy:
http://www.altmuslim.com/a/a/a/2339/
http://www.altmuslim.com/a/a/a/2337/
http://www.altmuslim.com/a/a/a/2238/
I was a little away, got to visit the blog after a while, glad to hear these nice things. But I do not think that Muhammad was in some kind of a requirement to kill apostates. I think killing, censorship and state support are required to the ideas that are weak and do not have a standing of their own. It is mentioned to blame the communities that did not take Islam up at that time and who thought Mohammad was mad that they rejected in light of clear proofs provided to them. But I find no clear proofs and no clear reasons to fight with those who disbelieved in his time. Many of the wars did not even have a clear proper reason except the expansion of Islam and annihilation of the disbelievers. I would have been killed without a trace if born in that time because I can not get myself to believe in Islam. Or, I would have been humiliated and made to pay a disbeliever tax. Anyway, Quran obviously takes an upper hand and I will take your interpretation to be correct.
Pardon me for saying this but you nice people are much better than the prophet.
@Ak,
Why do you hate the Prophet so much? Is it because you are an atheist and you find somebody who believes being very successful?
I am being very serious. Sometimes, atheists really envy believers on account of the serenity the latter enjoy.
Ak,lol..almost all people in this world are nice..Just a few rotten apples here and there..Just pick them out and throw away,because if retained,they’ll more harm than any good..
Hi, sorry I am out of town, great to see that there are so many new posts here. Anyway, I do not hate the prophet, he was human like you and me. But all humans are not the same, you are all kind to others, I read the life of the prophet and I find there are not many things inspiring or nice about him. That is why my comment. I have been reading the apologetic sites like IRF of Zakir naik and all but I find no answers worthy of mention.
I do not particularly find anything successful or unsuccessful about believing in God, it simply has no connection. And Milind, I have not noticed any serenity, self control or success in you gentlemen to be able to envy it. My analysis is purely incidental to reading about the prophet.
Hi Ak,glad to hear from you 🙂
Yeah,true,Prophet is only a human being and obviously we may find fault with him..
And being a muslim alone is not a reason for somebody to have self control and successful..Life is much beyond religion alone…Well,atleast thatz how i perceive it…